Object of my desire

A while back Rody Walter of Groovy Cycle Works posted a blog entry about his new Lagun Vertical Mill.

Here is a link to the entry:
http://groovycycleworks.blogspot.com/2009/10/object-of-my-desire.html

I found this entry to be great since Rody and I both share a similar liking for machine tools. I agree when people say that the tools do not make the product but if you know what you are doing with the machine they really can be a joy to use. Also we are unfortunately in a time when the best of the best equipment sells for pennies on the dollar. This is sad but I personally feel it is also an opportunity for me to own what was considered unobtanium in decades past. This brings me to the root of this entry. One tool that has always been my obsession is the toolroom lathe. I have found this machine to be the hardest to find in excellent condition and not having an unrealistic cost considering the majority of the market is hobby machinists. I had 4 machines on my wish list and they were the following. Hendey T&G, Rivett 1030, Schaublin 150 and a Monarch 10EE 30inch. I am not saying I would pass up a Rivett 1020S or a 10EE with the 20 inch bed but they were a compromise and I did not want them. These are all rare machines and when or if they pop up for sale it is usually a bidders war since they are rare. Well I was persistent and determined to find one and I now am the proud owner of a Monarch 10EE 30 inch lathe. It is original paint and in really good shape. It did not look like this when I got it I can assure you but under all the grit and grime was an amazing work horse from the sixties.

Read the blog entry in description

People will ask will this make your bikes better? I say yes for many reasons. It is an incredible machine and will assist me in making superior tools for bicycle making. It can remove metal at a rate 4 times faster than most other machines its size and still leaves a mirror finish in one pass. Also it just plain makes me happy and that will make a better bike in itself. I think they are all good qualities.

It weighs in at 3,640 lbs and I can assure you it feels it when you try to move it about 100 yards with manual equipment. Eventually I will get the electrics all squared away and make some chips.

I hope everyone has a great weekend and did not mind my over the top technical entry??

Cheers,
Drew

Comments

cirque

Submitted by awetmore on Tue, 04/13/2010 - 3:31pm.

I wish I could make it to Cirque this year, but I'll be at a wedding in Portland that weekend. I've missed all of the shows this year (San Diego is the one that I really wanted to go to).

I don't have any explicit plans, but will probably make it out there sometime this summer or early fall.

CNC in 50 years

Submitted by awetmore on Mon, 04/12/2010 - 10:45am.

That 10EE is an impressive looking machine. I hope to see it in person next time I'm in Philadelphia. It is incredible to think of the sheer mass of that lathe, it is 3-4x heavier than my Southbend 9A and it's bench, yet occupies the same floor space.

I agree that the modern CNC stuff probably isn't being made to the same high quality, so the machines probably won't survive that well 50 years from now. I'm just guessing at that though, since I haven't worked with a large CNC machine. On the other hand if they do survive I don't worry about the outdated computers making them useless. Replacing the electronics, steppers/servos, and controller boards isn't that big of a deal, and the mechanical parts of the machine don't care if they are being run by a 1985 PC running DOS or a 2045 PC running who knows what.

I like my tiny CNC mill, but it isn't as useful in a bike shop as good manual machines. The operations on bicycles and for making one off tooling aren't the repeated operations that really benefit from CNC anyway.

10EE

Submitted by drew on Mon, 04/12/2010 - 7:49pm.

Alex,
I look forward to your next visit. Are you coming in for the cirque?

The things I see as weaker links on the new stuff are mostly in the shear mass of things. A new lathe for example (most everything is an import) will weigh in around 1200 lbs for a 13x30 or so machine. The base is usually sheet metal construction and the ways are hardened but not usually to the extent that the older machines were hardened. Lots of new stuff is case hardened. I have read of some real nightmares about new equipment.

There are still good quality American and European machines but the days of overbuilding something like this machine are long gone. The two machines I have that seem part of a time long gone are my Deckel FP1 and this Monarch. Also my Greenerd arbor press is massive and they surely don't make them like that anymore.

Sorry for the long winded reply!

-Drew

Then and Now

Submitted by drew on Mon, 04/12/2010 - 10:04am.

There are very few machines made today that are intended to be around in 50-100 years. It is just not part of the plan. These machines are a dead breed and nobody builds machinery with the same quality iron as in the past. The castings are not the same as well as the amount of handwork that went into them. CNC machines of today will be in the scrap yard in 50 years no matter how well cared for (IMO).

I use CAD for drafting and have a DRO on one machine. I hate digital calipers and use vernier and dial calipers and indicators for everything. Batteries always seem suspect for me. I trust my eyes for now.

Cheers,
Drew

Machines

Submitted by Eric G on Mon, 04/12/2010 - 9:56am.

What happens in a generation from now when all the "old" machines of this quality are CNC with obsolete computers and fried electronics?

I guess you are planning to hold onto your machines and wait for the apocalypse?

Other than perhaps drafting software, do you use any other electronics to build frames? Is that an interesting question?